IRC rules changes

[TheNamelessWonder]

With the new age approaching, I think we could stand to look over a couple of the rules, and make changes where there ought to be. I have two suggestions in particular, feel free to add or criticize as you will.


1) It is pretty much always enforced, but there is no explicit rule against soliciting individual IDs. I can see no reason why this should not be expressly written into the rules.

2) Current rule: 7.1 Channel staff hold the right to kick, ban or warn anyone for reasons they see fit. See anything wrong with this? Yes there are appeals and checks on ops' power, but this gives them the right to basically do whatever they want. Even if this is not upheld in practice, a rule this vague needs to be fixed.



Discuss.

 

[Alcibiades]

Re: IRC rules changes

With the new age approaching, I think we could stand to look over a couple of the rules, and make changes where there ought to be. I have two suggestions in particular, feel free to add or criticize as you will.


1) It is pretty much always enforced, but there is no explicit rule against soliciting individual IDs. I can see no reason why this should not be expressly written into the rules.

Has my support for obvious reasons.

2) Current rule: 7.1 Channel staff hold the right to kick, ban or warn anyone for reasons they see fit. See anything wrong with this? Yes there are appeals and checks on ops' power, but this gives them the right to basically do whatever they want. Even if this is not upheld in practice, a rule this vague needs to be fixed.

The sentiment that that rule expresses is necessary although the wording leaves quite a lot to be desired. As I stated in another thread, this rule exists to cover those unforeseen acts which are not covered explicitly in the IRC rules. I object to abuse of power as much as the next man (hell read the majority of my gripes and complaints about IRC Operator abuse and you'll see my history on that score...) but I fully understand and support the intent of this rule.

The problem with this rule lies with the Operators themselves; not the rule. That rule is not abusive in and of itself. The solution to that is to go to the higher authority, namely Azzer.

Current #Bushtarion Operators (@ by their nick): Angela, Azzer, Bobbin, Charlie_B, Darryl, Gadfly, Hk|random, MaXiMuZZZ, Meneldil, Squiffy [a bot] and Treedude.
Current Bushtarion Official Helpers (+ by their nick): ShadowStrike, Darryl, Marty, Kal, Max, Iliard, Turnip, Meneldil, Becks, Gadfly, Azzer, Angela, Bobbin, Treedude, Monk, Timster, Dematto, Rachet, Adept, Mumble.

That is wildly out of date and needs a bit of editing too.

 

[tobapopalos]

Re: IRC rules changes

I love rule 7.1. It's the awesome loophole which allows ops to justify any of their kicks/bans, and tbh I think it's very much needed.

 

[No-Dachi]

Re: IRC rules changes

I propose extending the use of warnings before kicks. Obviously not in severe cases, but in the lighter situations, where there's either a funny conversation going on/people joking, or there's an obvious misunderstanding/misinterpretation of the rules.

 

[BlackWolf]

Re: IRC rules changes

I dont see reason why such rule must exist in that "rules" thing. Actually whole rule is there just SO OPs can do what ever they wish, you see there was time before such rule and because our OPs behave like they do (power hungry...*put your desired curse word here), Azzer was so overwhelmed with negative responses so he decided to let OPs do what ever they wish, ensuring the current state of IRC where I personally know some 20 or so people who uses IRC but dont ever step in to #bushtarion.

There are no such thing that couldnt be listed in rules and which wouldnt lead to warning/kick/ban already (not counting this ask IDs thing). After that theres simply 4 things you can do:
Spam,Curse,Insult someone, multi join (bots).

There are no other things people can do. Funny thing is that on other channels people dont need rules, I wonder why the frell we need any other rules but "be civilized towards any and all other" or someting along those lines. Cause rules are more for OPs than for players maybe?

Wheres the problem in that?

 

[WildDisease]

Re: IRC rules changes

I dont see reason why such rule must exist in that "rules" thing. Actually whole rule is there just SO OPs can do what ever they wish, you see there was time before such rule and because our OPs behave like they do (power hungry...*put your desired curse word here), Azzer was so overwhelmed with negative responses so he decided to let OPs do what ever they wish, ensuring the current state of IRC where I personally know some 20 or so people who uses IRC but dont ever step in to #bushtarion.

There are no such thing that couldnt be listed in rules and which wouldnt lead to warning/kick/ban already (not counting this ask IDs thing). After that theres simply 4 things you can do:
Spam,Curse,Insult someone, multi join (bots).

There are no other things people can do. Funny thing is that on other channels people dont need rules, I wonder why the frell we need any other rules but "be civilized towards any and all other" or someting along those lines. Cause rules are more for OPs than for players maybe?

Wheres the problem in that?

I agree to this. I don't mind the rule to exist for "unforeseen" acts because they do happen but if it has enforced since Day 1 of IRC Rules, it is clearly not "unforeseen".
It is also not "unforeseen" that I user may ask for someone's ID either directly or indirectly, in casual conversation or in a hostile one.

The rules cover the pasting of IDs or the "noobs are being hit, pm for id list" but it does not in no way cover asking for IDs, not even in an equitable way that Azzer refers to. I can probably pull out logs from back when Angela and such was actively playing and an IRC and see the offenders are ALWAYS the one who paste it, not whom ask for it.

It seems too brutal and offensive to kick the one asking. I know I was a bit offended and felt disrespected after so many rounds of playing and in #bushtarion that some new op would try to show me down, so of course I brought it to the player's attention. I would urge for this rule to be explicitly stated as it is just as common and supposedly just as harmful as someone pasting the ID.

Just like the game, I think the IRC rules need revision. You can't have a rule for everything but you can cover the common infractions that do arise, like this one. Term 7.1 should only use under the strictest of cases and events. As I've stated, the term gives ops an infinite power over the users of #bushtarion, and one would hope for the greater good but it should NOT be referred to and justified with simply because someone asked for another player's ID, especially in the context in which it was.

And to every ignorant fr00bcake who posted in my thread of this issue, this is what I wanted it to lead to.
The mere issue of being kicked for breaking an unwritten law is a common sign for a corrupt government in the real world. Just like civilization, we need rules in IRC. I wasn't "crying" for being kicked from a said "rule", I was offended and upset at breaking one that was not even there.

 

[tobapopalos]

Re: IRC rules changes

I suggest you have a nice cup of tea and tell your therapist about how the big nasty op hurt your feelings.

Give me a ****ing break. According to your user profile you are 39 years old. 39 years old and you get upset about getting kicked from an irc channel. Jesus christ...

 

[WildDisease]

Re: IRC rules changes

I suggest you have a nice cup of tea and tell your therapist about how the big nasty op hurt your feelings.

Give me a smegging break. According to your user profile you are 39 years old. 39 years old and you get upset about getting kicked from an irc channel. Jesus christ...

If you did the math, you'd know that year is 1969, so take a joke and have your balls drop already.
Where does it say Alci hurt my feelings? It has nothing to do with feelings?

Alci isn't what makes the Bushtarion community a bad place to be apart of, it's retarded players like you.

 

[tobapopalos]

Re: IRC rules changes

Where does it say Alci hurt my feelings? It has nothing to do with feelings?

It seems too brutal and offensive to kick the one asking. I know I was a bit offended and felt disrespected after so many rounds of playing...

If the year 1969 is a joke then it's a pretty poor one.

And oh noes, pwease don't call me wetarded. I'm not the one making a massive deal out of absolutely nothing. You got kicked from the channel because you asked for an ID. If you've been playing as long as you say then you should know that asking for IDs isn't allowed. Any op would've done the same as Alci. It's not even like you got banned for doing it. You rejoined the channel right away and that should've been the end of it. But nooooooo, you had to start bitching and whining on forums about how life is unfair and how ops are the spawns of Satan, and how you really can't believe it's not butter.

I find this entire debacle utterly sickening.

 

[pinpower]

Re: IRC rules changes

In my honest opinion...

Neither of these changes are necessary...

Just not needed.

 

[Alcibiades]

Re: IRC rules changes

pinpower i love it when you're honest with me. gives me frissons up and down my spine

I think the first one should be implemented, post haste. The second one won't ever be removed (imo) if i gauge the attitude correctly. As i stated, the problem lies with the way the rule is invoked, not the fact that the rule exists.