spike traps

[willymchilybily]

spike traps.(there is a question comming)
I cant decide on the usefulness of spike traps. As the routes that can get them rely heavily on lethals. so if some one is going to attack them they will try to kill thiere lethals generally. so with spike traps if you get raped they will generally die to.

also with injuries they are good. but they dont permanantly kill the flack. unless the person is attacking unlawfully. then they kill 60+%. but they only stop around 20trops for each trap

so surely now sleepers are much more effective since injuries have come out. they only cost 12k and can stop 13 men with 1 trap. and that can go a bit lower. but generally against flack they can get 13:1 even as high as 17:1. sure they dont kill. but half the stuff you kill doesnt stay dead. so surely now with injuries spikes are relatively obselete.

i know i always keep a few million around. and they do marginally better against tractors than sleepers. but sleeprs dont die as easily due to them being a [NLT] which isnt as easy to target when there are lethals around. also i know spikes have some more armour. can give marginal amounts of armour to the sa' route when home. but nothing that makes any difference, and i know about multi tiered blockers.

so my question is....does any one else think we should change spike traps?....for a different unit, or just in a different way...or am i alone.

 

[Maxi]

Re: spike traps

but half the stuff you kill doesnt stay dead. so surely now with injuries spikes are relatively obselete.

That's like saying all LETs are obsolete now that half the stuff you kill doesn't stay dead.

I don't think Spike Traps need a change, they're perfectly fine and a great early Unit, especially for Solos. You can use it later in the round aswell, when last ticking. So yes, you are alone.

 

[harriergirl]

Re: spike traps

alone.

I <3 my spikes

 

[DarkSider]

Re: spike traps

The thing is you are too focused on your route to analize the usefulness of spike traps on the other branches of SO.

 

[BlackWolf]

Re: spike traps

There is one other factor with spikes that people has forgot completely, but hell not gonna tell you. Figure it out by yourself.

 

[Maxi]

Re: spike traps

Well that was really helpful BW, and to be honest I was very tempted to quote a certain sentence from your latest gripe.

And willy, what would you suggest changing or replacing them with? Also, you mentioned that you always keep a couple million of them. Means they're not so useless after all?

 

[Garrett]

Re: spike traps

spikez are da shizzle. very useful to defend vs pomz. plus all others of kinds of reasons. stab.

 

[willymchilybily]

Re: spike traps

I guess spikes do shoot b4 sleeprs and also b4 hippys and pa's which target nlt's second..so are harder to flack to some degree. But they still die pretty easily. and early on are good last tick to stop pa's killing you sleepers. but none the less....

as much as i like my spikes. i guess looking at it solely from a bunker route they will either die or just be hitting flack which sleepers £for£ are better at (depending on the flack ofc). i guess sometimes i wish i had one more mobile unit early on, and for flacking later on as well. as in my set up if i die my spikes die. and if some one tries to flack past my spikes target all any way. so they don't hone in, they only try to sweep for my sleepers which also target all

I was just thinking i'd have more fun if i had a political briber instead. ofc highly unfair. i have no use for a stealth thief either as bunker. and chem sprayer destroys seeds. when i'd rather steal them

I guess it is just me. I think it has a role but an almost insignificant one from what i can tell. Im obv newb. and aint using them right . but personally id rather a slightly different unit. something to help me flack. anything mobile. but yeah i know it aint ever going to happen. as no one agrees. and azzer already has a mountain of coding to do i bet anyway.

not to mention it would have to be replaced by something balanced. i guess if you go bunker thats what you get. serves me right for being a land whore.

 

[Martin]

Re: spike traps

There is one other factor with spikes that people has forgot completely, but hell not gonna tell you. Figure it out by yourself.

They are armour


The usefullness comes is that they are more cost effective than Sentries at killing flak, and as the biggest issue for Bunker players is PoMs. They are generally a good idea to stock up on so ya kill more!

 

[saint1d]

Re: spike traps

Spikes are definately useful early on, and for last ticking at any stage of the game, but I always end up buying sleepers cos they are way cheaper and there are less troops that target NLT than LET.

I'm playing SA this round and I didnt bother dev'ing them, went for stealth thieves instead. The only time I really missed spikes is when I had vamp inc a few weeks ago and I wanted to hurt them last tick

 

[BlackWolf]

Re: spike traps

Marty hit the sweet spot in this one... yet no one seems to notice... and no one seems to use those. Lets see whats worst routes there are against you if your SO? PoMs and Vamps right?
So what those 2 cant do... armour damage.
Yet no one uses these insanely good LET flak to stop those 2 routes from pwning them. Spikes are cheap flak for SAs and sins to survive. At cost of 40k you can get 4* Armoured units that are fast firing and do pretty nice damage too.
People only think of SO as attacking route which power lies in that. Yet they get their asses whooped at their own base by those routes. By losing some offencive firepower you can pretty much cover your ass on home front and as that spikes are kick ass unit for SOs.
Too bad people can only see one side of this game and its routes. They come to forums and ask for ratios and all they ever learn is to use their routes by that one and simple way even they been playing for rounds and rounds.
This is only one example of such thing. Theres plenty of more of such routes and setups that people dont know about and dont even want to learn about.

 

[Cheese]

Re: spike traps

There is one other factor with spikes that people has forgot completely, but hell not gonna tell you. Figure it out by yourself.

They are armour


The usefullness comes is that they are more cost effective than Sentries at killing flak, and as the biggest issue for Bunker players is PoMs. They are generally a good idea to stock up on so ya kill more!

have to disagree with you there martin
Cost for cost if you take into account all 3 ticks spikes aint as good as sents

 

[BlackWolf]

Re: spike traps

Actually i must disagree a bit here Cheese.
Its actually better to buy spikes than to pile up on sentries.
That 3rd layer they are making behind sentries is actually much more effective than just having loads of sents.
But in that i agree that on bunker route spikes are not needed in massive amounts.

 

[DarkSider]

Re: spike traps

Cost for cost against pure gards spikes are about 25% more efficient. But that is pure ratio against gards. I wouldn't even compare the usefulness of the 70% let fireing of the sentry and it's insane armour with the 25% increased efficiency of spikes.
The main use of spikes is on the agent branch. The imobile units have next to no use in ally play and you have to look at them almost entirelly from solo point of view. Is it a big surprise a Pom landing with next to no looses on a SO-agent solo without spikes ? Hell i even see this SO's farmed of sleeptraps on regular basis. Try to bribe some spikes with no looses, i bet it's a bit harder